1st Kayak build - Laker or Freedom 11

VTFogg · Post by **VTFogg** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 11:39 am

I built an Uncle John's pirogue last year and very much enjoyed building it with my sons. Now I would like a kayak and am considering a Laker or Freedom 11. It looks like the Laker may be a bit easier to build than the Freedom model, and I'll take Mick's building this model as a strong endorsement. However, I would like to hear your thoughts on the pros/cons of these two models.

I would plan to use the kayak on a combination of rivers and small lakes for general paddling adventures and some fishing. Of course, the boys will want to use it too, and it will need to be able to take some hard use. I'm not looking for the fastest or most stable boat, but more of an all purpose design.
I didn't have any real problems building the pirogue, but I am NOT the most experienced woodworker. That said, I do not shy away from a challenge either.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

VTFogg
Rutland, Vermont

tx river rat · Post by **tx river rat** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:53 pm

My 2 cents
There isn't that much difference between the builds of the Laker and the freedom. I built the Laker and my first build was the Freedom 15 I haven't built the 11 yet
The Laker is an awesome little boat and the Freedom is a winner to.
I am not as experienced a yaker as Mick and the Laker has taken some getting use to , sitting low as you can and foot braces are a must in this boat. In my Freedom a lot more stability and reasonable speed not a slow boat at all. They are completely different animals I have about a 100 miles on my Laker and 150 on my Freedom love both boats but they shine in different areas.
Ron

Oldsparkey · Post by **Oldsparkey** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:05 pm

If you think you are going to use it for camping then I would suggest the Freedom 15 , I have used mine several times for 4 to 7 day camping trips and it works like a dream.

Chuck.

Post by **jem** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:14 pm

As far as drawing things out, Laker will be easier.

But after the pieces are cut out, it's the same to build one or the other. Freedom has a an extra panel so that might take a bit longer in assembly.

hairymick · Post by **hairymick** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 4:48 pm

G'day Foggy,

I haven't built either Freedom models yet so I can't really comment on them performance wise.

I will tell you this though, I bloody LOVE my Laker. it is my favourate GP boat for day trips.

These are a very good boat and I have no hesitation in recommending them. I have fished from mine, played in small surf and plan on using it in some small rapids very soon. They seem to me to be the perfect compromise in a small boat. Speed, tracking, stability and manouverability, yet still maintaining a lively feel to them.

By all reports, Freedon is a very good boat as well. I think Freedom would have to be a very good boat indeed to be better than Laker. Like Chuck said, if you are planning on camping, Freedom 15 would be a better option. (or perhaps a bigger Laker)

VTFogg · Post by **VTFogg** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:10 am

Ugh! Ok, it sounds like the Freedom 15 is more stable than the Laker, but I am not considering the 15 because I want something shorter for the tight turns needed to maneuver around logs on some of our small rivers. Plus, I think an 11' or 13' boat would be easier to load on the van in combination with my pirogue. Even the Freedom 11 still "looks" more stable than the Laker. Is it? Mick, can you explain "GP boat" please?

Also, I am unfamiliar with what form the plans for these boats are in. Do we receive a template for each piece to be cut (and then trace each piece)? For email plans, do I need to bring them to a professional printer for printing on a plotter? Do we get simple measurements for each piece? If so, how are the curves and arcs drawn on the wood?

I've got a lot to learn so thank you for allowing me to benefit from your experiences. I've still got to paint our family room and lay a hardwood floor (gotta keep the wife happy!), but want to plan this project out in my old noggin well in advance.

VTFogg

hairymick · Post by **hairymick** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:21 am

G'day Foggy,

BY GP, I mean General Purpose.

Mate I haven't built a Freedom so I can't compare the two. Having said that, I think the Freedom would be more stable, if that is important to you.

Email plans. typically, can be printed on what we call A4 paper or normal printing paper. If you have a real flash printer, capable of bigger sheets, you can print them on that or take them to a printer shop and get them to do it for you.

In the past, I have emailed them to myself at my work and used the printer there to do A3 prints which are the same size as bought drawings.

The hull panels are drawn onto the ply by the builder. What this means is that a 8' X 4' sheet of ply, is measured and marked into 1' segments across it. Measurements are then taken from the edge of the ply along these lines and then the dots are joined up. - easy

The plans are simple and really easy to follow. Have a look at the tips and tricks section here or some of the build threads. If you have a tape measure and pencil, you can do it!! its easy. My Swampgirl build is by no mean a tutorial in fine workmanship but you will see how I marked the panels out.

viewtopic.php?t=243

Jimmy W · Post by **Jimmy W** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:50 pm

Do we get simple measurements for each piece? If so, how are the curves and arcs drawn on the wood?

Yes, you will get drawings with measurements for each piece. Connect the points for the curves with a long wood batten or piece of tubing. I used a piece of quarter round trim.
Matt's tutorial:
viewtopic.php?t=26

Post by **jem** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 6:22 pm

VTFogg wrote: Even the Freedom 11 still "looks" more stable than the Laker. Is it?

it is.

VTFogg wrote:Also, I am unfamiliar with what form the plans for these boats are in. Do we receive a template for each piece to be cut (and then trace each piece)? For email plans, do I need to bring them to a professional printer for printing on a plotter? Do we get simple measurements for each piece? If so, how are the curves and arcs drawn on the wood?

If you scroll to the bottom of the write ups, there's a list of what you'll get in the plans. In summary, you'll draw the panels from points provide on drawings printed on 11 x 17 paper. If there's a tricky curve, you'll get a pattern for that curve, but not the entire panel.

I can provide full-scale templates if you want. But it will raise cost around $80.

VTFogg · Post by **VTFogg** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:23 pm

Gentlemen, thank you for explaining how the plans are transferred. As to which model, hmmmm maybe a Laker first......then a Freedom!

VTFogg